Ep. 114: Mangasplaining: Listen To Me! With Graphic Novel Librarian Robin Brenner
June 5, 2024
Did you know that comics, graphic novels, and manga can (usually) be found at your local library? We talk to American Library Association’s Graphic Novel and Comics Roundtable President Robin Brenner about her history promoting manga in libraries and how you can save a few bucks and enjoy your tax dollars at work at your local library!
Mangasplaining: Listen to Me! Interview with Robin Brenner, Graphic Novel Librarian Audio Editing by David Brothers. Show notes by Christopher Woodrow-Butcher and Deb Aoki
In summer of 2023, Christopher and Deb headed to the American Library Association’s Annual Conference (ALA Annual), in sunny Chicago, IL, USA, to exhibit for the first time as Mangasplaining! We handed out manga samplers provided by Kodansha, we did a survey on comics in libraries, and we took the opportunity to interview the ALA Graphic Novels & Comics Round Table President Robin Brenner for the podcast!
ABOUT:
Robin E. Brenner is Teen Librarian at the Brookline Public Library in Massachusetts. She chaired the ALA/YALSA Great Graphic Novels for Teens Committee, was a judge for the 2007 Eisner Awards, and blogs at SLJ’s Good Comics for Kids and Early Word. Her guide Understanding Manga and Anime was nominated for a 2008 Eisner Award. Robin has been working with teens as a librarian for over ten years, and she runs two book clubs at the Brookline library: one on teen literature for both teens and adults, and one on graphic novels and comics also for both teens and adults. Robin is the current President of the Graphic Novels & Comics Round Table at the ALA, and the founder of the website No Flying, No Tights, which reviews comics and manga for young readers.
1:20: The GNCRT, the Graphic Novel and Comics Round Table, is the official group that organizes library workers that work with comics (of any kind!) can be found at ala.org/gncrt.
Speaking of the American Library Association, they’re kind of having a rough go right now due to some pretty nefarious efforts to ban books, and hurt the people who try to defend your right to read. If you’ve got a few spare dollars, consider donating to the ALA and support the good work that they do. https://ec.ala.org/donate
2:30: I don’t think we mentioned this anywhere else in the show notes, probably saving it for this episode that we knew was coming (eventually…), but Deb and Christopher, and Christopher’s partner Andrew, exhibited at the American Library Association Annual Conference (ALA Annual) in Chicago, IL, in summer of 2023. It was the first convention that we had exhibited at as Mangasplaining or MSX: Mangasplaining Extra. We were there to promote Mangasplaining, our first book OKINAWA by Susumu Higa, and talk about manga in general. It was a great success, and we really appreciate ALA and the GNCRT for giving us the opportunity. Here’s a bit of what our “Artist’s Alley” booth looked like:
Deb made Mangasplaining Stickers! Grab one from us next time you see us.
This episode took so long to post, we actually just went back again to ALA Annual 2024 in San Diego, CA, with a different set up: This time, Deb put together a manga reading library of recommended titles from all kinds of publishers, including many titles that we’d talked about on the podcast. And of course, our very own Mangasplaining Extra books!
This was set up in the Graphic Novel and Comics Round Table lounge, so folks could comfortably hang out and read comics in a quieter space, alongside some other fun activities. Deb and Chris took time hanging out here to talk with folks about graphic novels too.
As you might have noticed, ALA Annual 2024 was also the first show that our two new MSX: Mangasplaining Extra titles, Search and Destroy by Atsushi Kaneko and based on Dororo by Osamu Tezuka, and Giga Town: A Guide to Manga Iconography by Fumiyo Kouno. It was so awesome to be there promoting three of our titles!
Even better news, since its debut Okinawa had been picked as one of the top 10 graphic novels for adults by the GNCRT! We’re in great company too!
So yeah, it’s safe to say that we love manga, love libraries, and have loved our time at the ALA. It was a ton of work though, so we’d have to see what we could do for 2025 that was a little less labor-intensive.
Still, thank you to everyone who came by and said lovely things about the podcast and our books, it was AMAZING being at the show and seeing people in person after such a long absence from doing events, and we didn’t even get COVID so that was nice.
With great friends and superstar graphic novel librarians Tina Coleman, Robin Brenner, and Eva Volin.
3:28: I didn’t catch this at the time, but Robin Brenner mentioned “manga in paperback,” and what she meant there is “manga in a format that we can lend out from a library, i.e. not floppy comics” as opposed to “manga in hardcover” or whatever. A lot of series that were published by manga publishers like VIZ and Dark Horse never got collected editions, or had only a volume or two collected out of a much longer run. Manga collections (trade paperbacks) also had a bad habit of not being kept in print, so some of them are quite rare. Luckily, over time, many of those series have sloooowly been reprinted or collected in new editions, but if you’re out there looking for like, Area 88 by Kaoru Shintani, published in the U.S. by Eclipse Comics/VIZ Media, well, enjoy buying single issue comics of a small part of the story on eBay.
4:05: I thought Robin talking about her book was the marketing/informational material that she produced in association with VIZ Media, “manga for Libraries” and “Manga 201.” I don’t think I put together that Robin was the author of Understanding Manga and Anime (Bloomsbury, 2007), which we definitely stocked at The Beguiling back in the day. Huh! The book is currently out of print, but there are good deals on used copies if you’re curious about the history of manga in North America.
14:30: I should probably clarify that not every single website in 2002 was necessarily “Superheroes First,” but it was most of them even when they, we, tried to fight against it. I was writing for a site I co-created at the time, and the most exciting work, the work that was dominating the discussion, definitely was produced in the superhero vernacular. Even if it wasn’t explicitly superheroes, it definitely used that language, that grammar. International comics (manga included) just weren’t stocked anywhere most people had access to comics, I even worked at a comic book store and getting even one manga volume in (to immediately sell) was a real fight with the owner. It wasn’t until I started working at The Beguiling in, well, 2002, that I became aware of just how much material was being produced within North America, and how much was being produced outside of it. Since then it’s been a life-long journey of learning, it’s been awesome.
Now, all of that said, it doesn’t REALLY matter so much now. The superhero stranglehold on the North American market has largely been broken by manga, kids comics, young adult comics, and webcomics/toons.The only superhero title in the top 20 bestselling comics of 2023 is My Hero Acadmia, by Kohei Horikoshi. Lol. But it’s worth noting it was a very different industry 20 years ago, and people like Robin Brenner (and a bunch of other lovely folks I should name one day) and sites like No Flying, No Tights, were there very early, fighting the good fight to bring comics to everyone.
17:27: Overdrive, Comics Plus+, and other services I mentioned are digital library lending services. Basically log in to your local library’s website with your library card, and you can see what service they’re using and access digital books online, for free, legally. We talk about this a little bit in a second, but it really is wild to me that you can do this, I would’ve loved this at a young age.
19:00: Actually as of this week, Robin is now at Woburn Public Library as their new Head of Reference and Programming. Congratulations, Robin!
19:30: Kind of a personal tangent, but I really, really wish at least the North American kids who are pirating manga would go get their work at public libraries instead of just stealing. It’s a great way to support the artists and the publishers. I understand if a work isn’t available legally in your area, but piracy to get it “early” or because you’re just too lazy to get a library card? Feels bad.
On that note, go apply for a library card at your local library system, and consider spreading the word about Brooklyn’s Books Unbanned initiative, where out-of-state teens can get a free library card to access digital titles via their system: https://www.bklynlibrary.org/books-unbanned . This whole end of the podcast inspired me to go kick them $50 to keep up the good work.
No shout-outs this time out, or like, info on the next episode or anything. These Mangasplaining Listen To Me! Episodes are short and sweet!
Thanks so much to Robin for sitting down with us to talk about manga and libraries and all kinds of good stuff, and thanks to you for listening. We’ll be back with Season 5, Episode 1, soon!
Thanks for this lovely interview. Wow–the founder of noflyingnotights–a site that for years now I often end up at…
It’s funny, I have a librarian mother, and practically grew up in libraries (my mom says I learned how to read at a young age because I wanted to be able to use the scrolling electronic catalogue things they had back in the 80s…) and yet, it was never on my radar to look for comics, let alone manga, at libraries. Some of this might just have been my location–when the 2000 manga boom that was mentioned happened, and suddenly titles I wanted to read, like ParaKiss and Mars (loved the shout outs to both) were out, I had moved to Montreal for school and they (at least then) had a pretty nonexistent Anglo library system. (In fact, I read a lot of French manga at the time–which was great as they were putting out things like Kyoko Okazaki…)
So this was pretty eye opening for me. I do know that my teen niece and nephew both do read a lot of library manga–I just never really put two and two together. A bit of a tangent (from me? Shocking…) but I have heard from others that a problem with some of the very few classic shojo titles we have that people would like to recommend others check out, a barrier has been that they aren’t legally available electronically and buying a volume is an expensive option if you aren’t sure you’ll like it (as you can probably guess I’m specifically talking about the gorgeous Udon Rose of Versailles and Fantagraphics Moto Hagio titles out there…) But if there was the option of checking them out from the library (I mean, c’mon, I’m not about to lend *my* copies out and trust they will remain pristine.)
Robin also just raises a lot of quick but fascinating thoughts–the way a lot of readers have a learning curve when it comes to even reading manga (I’m wondering if I ever did–but then again I got into it as a teen thanks to flipped Viz titles like Nausicaa and Four Shojo Stories, which may have helped.) Good stuff–really appreciate these interviews.
Hi Eric, It’s actually tough, because for classic titles digital rights can actually be really tricky, and a big part of the appeal of something like UDON’s RoV is the premium edition of it. I remain hopeful that digital rights can be sorted for some of these titles, but I know that some creators in Japan just refuse digital editions of their titles at all, meaning English is definitely not going to happen.
Thanks for the kind words too, glad you enjoyed the interview. I’d love to do more of these, we just have to find time and opportunity. 🙂
Thanks for this lovely interview. Wow–the founder of noflyingnotights–a site that for years now I often end up at…
It’s funny, I have a librarian mother, and practically grew up in libraries (my mom says I learned how to read at a young age because I wanted to be able to use the scrolling electronic catalogue things they had back in the 80s…) and yet, it was never on my radar to look for comics, let alone manga, at libraries. Some of this might just have been my location–when the 2000 manga boom that was mentioned happened, and suddenly titles I wanted to read, like ParaKiss and Mars (loved the shout outs to both) were out, I had moved to Montreal for school and they (at least then) had a pretty nonexistent Anglo library system. (In fact, I read a lot of French manga at the time–which was great as they were putting out things like Kyoko Okazaki…)
So this was pretty eye opening for me. I do know that my teen niece and nephew both do read a lot of library manga–I just never really put two and two together. A bit of a tangent (from me? Shocking…) but I have heard from others that a problem with some of the very few classic shojo titles we have that people would like to recommend others check out, a barrier has been that they aren’t legally available electronically and buying a volume is an expensive option if you aren’t sure you’ll like it (as you can probably guess I’m specifically talking about the gorgeous Udon Rose of Versailles and Fantagraphics Moto Hagio titles out there…) But if there was the option of checking them out from the library (I mean, c’mon, I’m not about to lend *my* copies out and trust they will remain pristine.)
Robin also just raises a lot of quick but fascinating thoughts–the way a lot of readers have a learning curve when it comes to even reading manga (I’m wondering if I ever did–but then again I got into it as a teen thanks to flipped Viz titles like Nausicaa and Four Shojo Stories, which may have helped.) Good stuff–really appreciate these interviews.
Awesome interview, thanks for posting this…
Hi Eric, It’s actually tough, because for classic titles digital rights can actually be really tricky, and a big part of the appeal of something like UDON’s RoV is the premium edition of it. I remain hopeful that digital rights can be sorted for some of these titles, but I know that some creators in Japan just refuse digital editions of their titles at all, meaning English is definitely not going to happen.
Thanks for the kind words too, glad you enjoyed the interview. I’d love to do more of these, we just have to find time and opportunity. 🙂
– Christopher